What truthers and debunkers have in common

What truthers and debunkers have in common

My first blog post in a while.

Intro

There are 3 things that I recently found both sides of these 9/11 conspiracy debates have in common. Let me get started right away.

First thing in common

Both sides at times see many on the other side as shilling for or being with the perpetrators or those responsible for 9/11. This is a generalization of course, and not all do this, and those that do may not claim all on the other side do this. But I am sure you've heard truthers claim debunkers are "government shills" or may have been called that yourself numerous times.

As a debunker, you might think several truthers sort of "shill" for the attackers by calling them "patsies" etc.

Either one side is correct or neither is correct.

Second thing in common

Both sides might think the other side is stupid or that they're "idiots".

Truthers may and often do call debunkers "sheep".

Debunkers often use the term "twoofers".

There are variations of course for both sides, but still. It's interesting how both sides believe this about the other.

Here I guess both COULD be correct. We ALL could be idiots, or, in the best case, none.

Often in real life though: people generally don't call actual idiots "idiots".

What I think it's really about here in the case of 9/11 are very different points of view making neither side unable to understand the perspective of the other side.

Truthers internally may be unable to understand other factions of the truther-community, but that's a separate issue.

The third thing in common

Finally, both sides often these days feel like the debate is over.

Truthers for their part have almost since I can recall when I began to look at this, perhaps in 2005 or so, said "We know what happened".

They also have videos claiming 9/11 has been "solved", but then point in the totally wrong direction and without evidence, but that's besides the point. The point is they claim it has been "solved".

You can probably think of variants of these where they basically say it's over.

Us debunkers may think these discussions sort of "ended" around 2011 or 2012 perhaps. At least, after 2006. We might think it's 2006 all the time in "trutherland" as many truthers seem to use arguments stemming from roughly that time-period although some arguments made then had been launched earlier.

So, many of us debunkers feel the debate is indeed over and that truthers lost (sorry truthers, just saying from our perspective). It was AQ that did it in our point of view with some of the finer details like what Saudi-Arabia did or what the support-network of the hijackers in the US were etc. to be worked out.

End thoughts

Although 3 things in common sounds pretty positive, I do not think it helps us move forward unfortunately. 

But it is very interesting how both sides can be so convinced of being correct even though the perspectives are so different so that likely one side ought to be correct, while the other isn't. Not saying which side though, even if I have my opinion as I wrote under the 3rd thing we have in common.

But perhaps these 3 things in common might make some of us more humble and understanding towards the other.

And you can probably come up with more things in common, such as how we both say we want to get to the truth and spread the truth. Hopeful I guess.

Going to FEMA camp this summer?

Summer time among other things means a time for different camps people of different ages can go to.

Will you go to FEMA camp this summer?

It has all the Kool-Aid you can drink! One of the perks.

They also have pools at the FEMA camps. Pools of molten steel... Very hot, but strong as...well, steel.

Who can attend the FEMA camp? 

Well, being a truther is a sure bet it seems according to some conspiracy theorists.

That's your ticket in. or, actually, you don't need a ticket! VIPs only though. Many prolonged stays however...

You can get to "shill" with the Debunkers at FEMA camp!

Experiences

Help yourself to a Bilderberger or maybe enjoy a "gubermint".

Don't worry, US taxpayers pay...

There's also waterboarding!

Ah, false flags are in the air... nothing like FEMA camp...

Day or night, FEMA camp attendees will be subject to attempts to "wake them up", sometimes literally.

The Illuminati is there to help with the lighting...

You can actually get your very own black box at FEMA camp! A personal one and it's actually black, not orange. Big though. or so says Alex Jones and he has shown pictures and videos.

FEMA camp is not to everybody's liking of course. "A few fries short of a Happy Meal" as they say. "A burger short of a combo meal", "a few tacos short of a fiesta platter", "a few toppings short of a Deluxe Pizza", "a few burgers short of a barbeque".

Supposedly some "bite the dust", but that's unconfirmed.

In summary

Either way you slice it, FEMA camp is quite an experience!

Truthers are...deniers?

At almost every major event for some years now, truthers and other conspiracy theorists have opposed and denied that things went down as "the media" claims it did. Examples of this are the Boston bombings, Sandy hook-shooting etc..

It's like they have a knee-jerk reaction to deny anything the mainstream media ("MSM") says, regardless of what it says.

How many of you would be willing to bet they would not claim that the next shooting we'll hear about in the news will be claimed to be some "false flag" to take away your rights in one way or another?

Apparently, many of them see the world in a totally different way those of us who don't think like that.

The human mind surely is amazing....

I'm not angry at those who genuinely believe in what they say normally. I do oppose liars and deceivers though.

Alex Jones is an example of such a deceiver. What's good is that even many truthers know this by now.


As an aside, it can be noted that some (certainly not all) truthers tend to lean towards "doubting" that the Holocaust actually happened, or at least as has been stated in our history books and, again, in the news...

Truthers' narrative questions by Sam

In a group I have about 9/11 on Facebook ("9/11 conspiracy theories are an inside job!") a member, Sam Beeson, made a comment where he wondered what truthers' narrative are regarding 9/11 if I allow myself to interpret his words. He asks why truthers don't have a single story. Further he brings up a number of questions he thinks one almost has to ask truthers just to see where they are coming from. I thought his comment with these questions were so good that I wanted to make a blog post about it. I will share his comment with the questions in full below.

Sam Beeson's comment(by "page" he means my group):

The truth movement would be much more believable if they would at least agree on a single story. Instead, whenever a new truther comes to this page to argue, you have to ask them 20 questions to find out what kind of truther they are.

1. Are you an inside job, LIHOPer, or combination?

2. Were the planes that crashed into the WTC real with passengers? Real, without passengers? Military Drones? Holographic images? Combination?

3. Was the plane that crashed into the Pentagon real with passengers? Real without passengers? Military drone? Missile? Other.

4. Was Flight 93 real with passengers? Real without passengers? Drone? Missile? None of the above? Other?

5. Thermite? Nukes? Space laser? Other?

6. Who was behind it? Bush? Cheney? The gas companies? The CIA? A Middle Eastern country? Bankers? The Illuminati? Reptilian aliens? The New World Order? Combination? Other?

In all seriousness, if truthers could answer these questions BEFORE they start debating, it might make things a little easier for us to argue with them.

Fair questions?

What are truthers' view of a narrative regarding 9/11?

What kind of truther are you?

Sadly, there is a group that very often gets the blame in different variations that you could add to his point 6, but the point is still made, and he knows which I mean. I have a rule against bringing them up for that reason among others, otherwise I am sure he would have brought them up there too. and "other" covers that any way.


Here you got a view from a debunking perspective. and a little questionnaire to bring to a new truther when you meet him or her.

Question everything? OK truthers, here are some questions...

9/11 Truthers often say "question everything". So, in that spirit we can pose some questions to the truthers themselves....

Question 1:

Why bother setting up explosives in the twin towers when hijacking planes and crashing them into US buildings is a good enough reason to go to a war?

Question 2:

Why did no media organization report trucks driving in with plane wreckage at the Pentagon after the plane had crashed into it (assuming it was no plane and they wanted to make it appear as if it were)?

Question 3:

Why bother crashing planes into buildings first, but then send a missile into the Pentagon? A huge building full with people one might expect would be able to tell the difference between a missile and a plane.

Question 4:

Why had no conspirator, other than AQ, come out and said they did this?

Question 5:

Why did so many countries and also NSA warn about a coming, big terror attack against USA by AQ prior to 9/11? For example, John Kerry was not surprised on 9/11 as he had seen the warnings. Richard Clarke had seen them too.

Question 6:

Why is Alex Jones still on the air and have so much money? If there was a huge international organization intent on world domination that was so evil that it carried out 9/11, it sure would not allow someone like Alex Jones running around bullhorning them, agitating against them one would think.

There are many other questions, but I'll stop here. The first 2 questions were not posed by me first, but by 2 members of my FB-group "9/11 Conspiracy Theories are an Inside Job!"